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Yeah, driving around won’t clear it for many people. I do the drive to get as hot as I can, then idle for however long it takes. Climate system off in Hybrid mode once the engine kicks on. Usually 30 min once it gets oil temps over 206f. If that won’t work for you, something is wrong with the Jeep.
Ambient temperature matters, not just oil temperate. I can clear form without my Oil getting over 90c. Again i've already posted all the parameters that can be monitored to see why the vehicle is is FORM, you should check it out
 

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Ev only mode is not FORM.
Thanks tips, what i'm telling you is there are far more parameters to FORM and allowing electric only operation. It's not an opinion its facts based on testing
 

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Thanks tips, what i'm telling you is there are far more parameters to FORM and allowing electric only operation. It's not an opinion its facts based on testing
I'm saying that you're conflating FORM and allowing ev only mode. There is some overlap there, but as your own thread shows, there are a ton of non-FORM variables that limit ev only use.


Let's put it this way... being in FORM will limit EV only, but having EV only limited does not mean you're in FORM.

Ambient temperature may limit your EV only, but that doesn't mean it puts you into FORM.
 

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That's right but some of those variables kicking in displays the FORM message despite it not being FORM, It's happened a few times.

Either way people make far to big of a deal about FORM. If they actually cared and wanted to understand it they would monitor their vehicle and find out when/why it's in FORM or the EV mode is locked out
 

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That's right but some of those variables kicking in displays the FORM message despite it not being FORM, It's happened a few times.

Either way people make far to big of a deal about FORM. If they actually cared and wanted to understand it they would monitor their vehicle and find out when/why it's in FORM or the EV mode is locked out
You're preaching to the choir if you're talking about trying to help people understand the inner workings of the vehicle.
 

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I haven’t experienced any problems exiting FORM once I read from someone else’s experience in the Pacifica threads, or with ambient temp EV only mode. I fully understand the parameters of when the vehicle will operate in electric only or why it won’t. Maybe I’m an outlier with this but I doubt it…
 

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I fully understand the parameters of when the vehicle will operate in electric only or why it won’t.
Is there a simple, A+B=C explanation somewhere? I know the Dan the engineer post laid out groundwork but even that was vague on some details. What confuses me is there seemed to be quite a few people in cold climates who never experienced FORM and enjoyed full EV use (with the expected decrease in battery range) all winter long. while the vocal minority was/is stuck in FORM hell.
 

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Is there a simple, A+B=C explanation somewhere? I know the Dan the engineer post laid out groundwork but even that was vague on some details. What confuses me is there seemed to be quite a few people in cold climates who never experienced FORM and enjoyed full EV use (with the expected decrease in battery range) all winter long. while the vocal minority was/is stuck in FORM hell.
The common denominator with the people that didn't get stuck in form is they all seemed to drive a lot. They regularly ran the engine for longer periods of time. It's the people that did lots of short trips that seemed to have the most issues. That's also exactly what you would expect to cause problems.
 

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Is there a simple, A+B=C explanation somewhere? I know the Dan the engineer post laid out groundwork but even that was vague on some details. What confuses me is there seemed to be quite a few people in cold climates who never experienced FORM and enjoyed full EV use (with the expected decrease in battery range) all winter long. while the vocal minority was/is stuck in FORM hell.
Straight outta the manual is accurate except for exiting FORM, which they increased drive time to possibly 2 hrs once up to correct oil temp.


The common denominator with the people that didn't get stuck in form is they all seemed to drive a lot. They regularly ran the engine for longer periods of time. It's the people that did lots of short trips that seemed to have the most issues. That's also exactly what you would expect to cause problems.
I do infrequent short trips of 30-40 miles round trip and I’ve been in FORM 4 times, 1 for fuel and 3 for oil, in 3,800 miles. But I always drive in Hybrid Mode and don’t get told Electric Mode unavailable. It just turns on the ICE. Unlike Electric Mode, where it’s telling you Electric Mode is temporarily unavailable under certain circumstances.
 

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Is there a simple, A+B=C explanation somewhere? I know the Dan the engineer post laid out groundwork but even that was vague on some details. What confuses me is there seemed to be quite a few people in cold climates who never experienced FORM and enjoyed full EV use (with the expected decrease in battery range) all winter long. while the vocal minority was/is stuck in FORM hell.
I can't give you an A B C Answer because i'm still data logging and finding out what the thresholds are, however when people say it was "cold" and their EV mode worked fine they need to specify what temperature exactly. If its -10c or colder It will not work in EV mode at all. To prove that I tricked the ambient Temp sensor when it was very cold out and found the vehicle will go in to EV mode but as soon as the temp sensor picked up cold temperatures it locked EV mode out. This was done only as a test and was done before I figured out which PID's to watch for to determine when EV mode would be locked out.

I wonder why Dan the engineer never posted all the parameters for EV mode lock out like I did......
 

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I do infrequent short trips of 30-40 miles round trip and I’ve been in FORM 4 times, 1 for fuel and 3 for oil, in 3,800 miles
You also take immediate action to get out of it. If one just lets it go for a while and continues to drive in the same manner that put them into FORM, it's likely to just drive them deeper onto FORM.
 

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Another issue contributing to FORM is when people just "set it and forget it" and leave it in Hybrid mode and don't switch to Electric. If you are on the verge of the temperature parameters for not being allowed in electric mode. Example for me between 0 to -10c leaving it in Hybrid mode will start and stop the engine multiple times. So being in cold weather and having multiple start/stop events = fuel/oil dilution. Where As if I make sure to selec electric mode right after start up then I have no issues staying in electric mode until 1. It gets too cold. 2. I deplete the battery and the ICE starts up.

This is a history of my past 2 weeks where it was below 0c most of the time, but buy selecting electric mode I never had the ICE start once, meaning no chance for the FORM parameters to start stacking up

 

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Another issue contributing to FORM is when people just "set it and forget it" and leave it in Hybrid mode and don't switch to Electric. If you are on the verge of the temperature parameters for not being allowed in electric mode. Example for me between 0 to -10c leaving it in Hybrid mode will start and stop the engine multiple times. So being in cold weather and having multiple start/stop events = fuel/oil dilution. Where As if I make sure to selec electric mode right after start up then I have no issues staying in electric mode until 1. It gets too cold. 2. I deplete the battery and the ICE starts up.

This is a history of my past 2 weeks where it was below 0c most of the time, but buy selecting electric mode I never had the ICE start once, meaning no chance for the FORM parameters to start stacking up

My 22 Sahara is a week old with 200 miles. Before yesterday- temps were above 30F. Not a single issue driving Electric (actually In hybrid mode but it prioritized battery until I hit the Highway or encountered a large uphill climb. Or battery depleted.

Yesterday temps dipped to 22F. Hybrid mode still used battery but the ICE came on way more often. Switched to Electric mode and I’d say it switched MORE to ice. Many ice engagements of like 20 seconds to a minute.Even when idling.

so it seems to me that the computer is setting itself up for FORM by deliberately doing the thing that it professes to STOP humans from doing: short cold starts in cold weather. Either locking out Electric Or letting you use Electric seems like it would be a better option than this self-defeating spiral.
 

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Just adding my experience while living in warmer climates with this …

I can always get into electric mode from the start, but if I trigger the ice manually or accidentally, there’s no going back to only electric without turning it off.

I’m sure when I first got it, it would let me go back to electric, or it would kill the ice itself after few minutes. Now It just says ‘electric mode unavailable’ and stays in hybrid.
 

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Just adding my experience while living in warmer climates with this …

I can always get into electric mode from the start, but if I trigger the ice manually or accidentally, there’s no going back to only electric without turning it off.

I’m sure when I first got it, it would let me go back to electric, or it would kill the ice itself after few minutes. Now It just says ‘electric mode unavailable’ and stays in hybrid.
You're in Step 1 of FORM
 

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FORM is an issue I am dealing with in the south. I'm a short distance driver it's one of the reasons I got a 4xe. I knew my 90 day fuel refresh was getting close cause I filled up the day after Christmas after I made a long trip. I use E save and burn gas but it's short trips 10-15 miles one way at most and rarely. I realize now not the way to run the engine in the jeep. today I got the oil changed in the 4xe cause I checked it and it was way over full and strong smell of gas. Just have to remember I need to make longer trips to heat up the oil and do it's thing.
 
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